Neurological EMP Devices
Kurt Feltenberger
(14 Apr 2018 03:46 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Neurological EMP Devices
Rupert Boleyn
(14 Apr 2018 03:57 UTC)
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Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rob O'Connor
(17 Apr 2018 10:25 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Kelly St. Clair
(18 Apr 2018 00:40 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Graham Donald
(18 Apr 2018 07:58 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Neurological EMP Devices
Bruce Johnson
(18 Apr 2018 18:47 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Neurological EMP Devices
Rob O'Connor
(19 Apr 2018 07:55 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Neurological EMP Devices
Rupert Boleyn
(19 Apr 2018 10:30 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Neurological EMP Devices
Phil Pugliese
(19 Apr 2018 21:58 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(20 Apr 2018 01:37 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Jeffrey Schwartz
(20 Apr 2018 17:59 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rob O'Connor
(21 Apr 2018 08:23 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Tim
(21 Apr 2018 09:31 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(23 Apr 2018 01:15 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
shadow97218@xxxxxx
(23 Apr 2018 19:50 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Phil Pugliese
(23 Apr 2018 20:34 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Neurological EMP Devices
Bruce Johnson
(24 Apr 2018 16:14 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Neurological EMP Devices
Phil Pugliese
(24 Apr 2018 18:53 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices Rob O'Connor (25 Apr 2018 02:04 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(25 Apr 2018 23:12 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Phil Pugliese
(26 Apr 2018 00:20 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rupert Boleyn
(26 Apr 2018 00:24 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(26 Apr 2018 22:08 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Graham Donald
(26 Apr 2018 01:58 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(26 Apr 2018 22:02 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rob O'Connor
(27 Apr 2018 07:48 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(28 Apr 2018 00:09 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Robert O'Connor
(29 Apr 2018 05:06 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rupert Boleyn
(29 Apr 2018 19:14 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rob O'Connor
(30 Apr 2018 08:37 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(30 Apr 2018 18:36 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Robert O'Connor
(02 May 2018 08:33 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(03 May 2018 00:21 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rupert Boleyn
(03 May 2018 02:56 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Richard Aiken
(04 May 2018 01:47 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Rob O'Connor
(05 May 2018 02:27 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Kenneth Barns
(05 May 2018 03:39 UTC)
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Re: [TML] Re: Neurological EMP Devices
Kenneth Barns
(23 Apr 2018 23:56 UTC)
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Tim Little wrote: > To me they look like the sort of photocopied "secret government > material" that anti-government groups might pass around between each other. Yes, yes, a thousand times yes. I should have been more clear in my initial post - they have the appearance (format) but not the substance (content) of official material. Leonard Erickson wrote: > There are surgical meds that have this effect. They paralyze the > voluntary muscles but don't affect the heart or lungs. They affect the heart and lungs indirectly to a potentially lethal degree. As Ken Barns goes on to point out, your respiratory muscles (e.g. diaphragm, intercostals) are striated ones just as the same as other skeletal muscle that can be controlled voluntarily. Volatile anaesthetic gases can depress skeletal muscle function to the point of flaccid paralysis if you give enough. Usually cardiovascular collapse happens around the same time. Derivatives were investigated as 'immobilising agents' but the ratio of lethal to effective dose is not very high... The purpose made neuromuscular blocking drugs (curare derivatives, aminosteroids, succinylcholine) can only be given by injection. > Apparently the gas worked it's way up the spine. So at first you'd > lose control of toes, then ankles, lower leg, upper leg, etc. This pattern doesn't fit with pharmacological neuromuscular blockade where active muscles get blocked first. Ascending paralysis of this sort is the classical presentation of demyelinating diseases like Guillain-Barre syndrome. Acutely interrupting the transmission of nerve impulses would require very large doses of sodium channel blockers that would lead to seizures and cardiac arrest in short order (the channel proteins are same in the various tissues). > So if you make it a gas rather than an "EMP" bomb, it'd be doable. Only if you are prepared to kill a good proportion of those exposed, given current understanding of the relevant physiology and pharmacology. The fentanyl derivatives used by Russian security forces in the Moscow theatre siege in 2002 are illustrative. Highly lipid soluble, so taken up into the bloodstream easily by inhalation. Extremely narrow therapeutic index, so death by central respiratory depression (suppressing medullary respiratory centre) was the result for too many of the victims. Rob O'Connor