The really cool thing about the GURPS Traveller books is the authors (and
playtesters) took the time to read through (at the time) 20+ years of
contradictory canon, work through the consequences of that canon, and design in
depth a consistent whole. The problem with that is it may not be the Imperium
you know or want to have.
When a world joins the Imperium (voluntarily or not), the government gives the
Imperium a piece of territory on which to build a starport. This port is owned
by the Imperium via the Starport Authority who appoints a director to manage the
port. The ports may charge standard fees for ships using the Imperial port, but
there are no taxes on the cargo traveling through the system, and the world can
not charge any fees at at all (The trade must flow).
There are no multi-world governments within the Imperium. When the Imperium
conquered them, they were disbanded.
Systems can build their own ports on their world, or other worlds in the
system. They can have corporations or private individuals build their own ports.
However these non-Imperial ports set their own rules. So most people not part of
the private starport club use the Imperial one for a consistency of service.
Like McDonalds, you always know what you are going to get even if you know what
are going you get is terrible.
The Imperium allows and encourages the member worlds to build and maintain
their own naval forces. So a world having a System Guard force is not
surprising. How much it mirrors the Imperial Navy (or any other historical naval
force) is a decision for the referee.
On 8/9/2020 8:42 PM, xxxxxx@gmail.com wrote:
> Thanks, Tom!
>
> I hadn't heard any of that (outside of GT... I may have browsed Starports a
> while back). Depending on how divergent we believe G:T to be from (whatever
> other flavour we might care to focus on) that could be anywhere from 'that
> works' to 'deny!'.
>
> I find it unlikely that any system that entered the Imperium after having
> populations on multiple worlds would choose to give up any import or export
> duties, tarrifs, taxes, etc. Those are used for political purposes and I could
> easily see worlds wanting to retain that control. (Being conquered is another
> matter, but that already breeds resentment)
>
> I also don't know how you can really prevent a world (short of being willing to
> embargo or rain fire down upon it) from charging import or export charges.
>
> Also, I don't think there's any guarantee that consignments move to or from the
> single mainworld starport that is run by the SPA (assuming all mainworld main
> starports are, which seems unlikely given how balkanized the REST of the TU is).
> What stops shippers going to or from other spaceports that can handle traffic,
> other stations, etc?
>
> Now, one would expect you'd go to the Imperial one if tarrifs were lesser. But...
>
> Does the Imperium allow worlds to decide what they will and will not accept on
> their world from Imperial territory? I believe so.
> If so, can a world allow trade traffic through its non-SPA spaceports while not
> accepting any imports nor allowing exports via the SPA mainworld port? Maybe.
>
> Or does every spaceport have to be run by the SPA?
> Or does every spaceport or ground landing facility (even as mundane as a flat
> bit of ground) need an SPA inspector?
>
> How does this work if you are on a balkanized world and you have multiple ports
> that each claim mutually independent status? If the Imperium does not want to
> muck in local politics (ha ha, like that's true....), deciding who gets the
> single mainworld SPA-run Imperial port is an interesting choice.
>
> And if a planet or nation on a planet is doing a whole lot of work to drive more
> trade to other planets, don't they have a strong argument to levy some taxes to
> help pay for the infrastructure planetside or the costs of promotion? This would
> really seem to be a form of restraint of trade to an extent (as can taxes, but
> modest taxes that generate larger returns actually can be a net benefit).
>
> Of course, the Imperium in GT seems much more 'together' and 'complete' in terms
> of how it goes about things and how it runs than some other looks at it from
> other versions of the game, so that may contribute.
>
> I'm pretty sure we've also seen cannonical ports in other publications that were
> mainworld ports that are not run by the Imperial SPA. I could be wrong, but I
> think so. (Can't put a finger to where and may have been from non-canon sources)
>
> I get that the Imperium would need the ports to be extraterritorial and that
> they want a uniform experience and legal status for their extrality areas (I
> suspect they'd frequently include consular facilities, embassies, recruiting
> offices, Imperial intelligence (unofficially), etc.). I get that the Imperium
> wants unimpeded trade off of which they take a %. (Which is funny because they
> don't want anyone else to collect a percentage... goose... gander?).
>
> Can a system (especially a system with a distributed polity in it which thus is
> a single entity) not arrange to control or regulate the space between its parts?
> That could be strictly *internal* trade to a single polity. Where does the
> Imperium apply?
>
> Even within system trade between various polities and corporate enclaves, where
> does the Imperium apply?
>
> I get that they (Imperium) probably want to have their hand in all interstellar
> trade, but in-system trade? Less clear to me.
>
> Now, for SAR, you aren't dealing with trade. So can you charge fees in a system
> to support that service? Can you, in your system as a system government, require
> everyone have SAR insurance to operate in your jurisdiction?
>
> Can you control traffic and inter-world (in-system) movement of goods and
> persons for security reasons?
>
> I don't know, but I think there's a fairly big can of worms here.
>
> That all said, there's surely an argument for a System Guard as a replacement
> for a Navy in many places (due to ideologies, fiscal realities, or just plain
> utility).
>
> There could also be private SAR operators in some places. The problem with that
> is, if they have to not spread the cost over an insurance-style service or pay
> for it by a general tax levy, any single call charge would be orders of
> magnitude more costly to pay for all the unfunded downtime and equipment -
> purchase, service, maintenance, qualification, etc.
>
> Thanks for the links to the Scout SAR campaign notes.
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 9, 2020 at 4:25 PM Thomas Jones-Low <xxxxxx@gmail.com
> <mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> I've just been spending a fair amount of time reading through
> GT:Starports in
> pursuit of updating the wiki articles on starports (and connected articles).
>
> Also, there was/is an ongoing campaign with the Imperial Scout
> Rescue service,
> which may provide ideas and background.
> 1) http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=40189
> 2) http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=40406
> 3) http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=41149
>
> Based upon my reading of GT:Starports, the Imperium generally, and
> the Starport
> Authority specifically, is tasked only with running the port. Which pushes the
> idea of a system coast guard service onto the system government itself.
> Services
> are paid for by local taxes as the system government has no ability to raise
> money from the ships conducting trade by Imperial decree.
>
> Officially.
>
> What is more likely is the local SPA director has several of your
> really neat
> designs available to perform specific SAR operations, and do some level of
> customs work.
>
> The Imperium allows worlds to build a local naval force. But given
> the Imperial
> Navy outclasses almost anything a local system could build and maintain, and
> most worlds are far enough from the border that the Imperial Navy should
> protect
> them, raising a system guard naval force may sound like a really good idea.
> Especially if there are colonies or stations on other worlds in the same system.
>
> The SPA can't charge post-fact charges for services rendered, but
> the world
> government could.
>
> On 8/9/2020 3:50 PM, xxxxxx@gmail.com <mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > The discussion of the Coast Guards in various places and particularly of the
> > USCG has led me to wonder what typical system wide rescue and system
> LE/security
> > might look like.
> >
> > I would assume that such a thing might start to exist once you'd been
> spacing
> > for a while and could get out to the various planets and belts and so on
> with
> > some ease enough to see some populations out there regularly and on a
> > sustainable basis.
> >
> > So such an entity might start to be relevant around TL-9, but TL-10 would
> likely
> > be where it started to be more robust and be justified in the economy and in
> > security terms.
> >
> > SG-SR would have several broad mandates:
> >
> > * Law enforcement of system-wide laws. In Imperial space, they could be in
> > addition to Imperial enforcement, work in conjunction with Imperial
> > enforcement, or they could even largely shoulder the burden to allow
> > Imperial assets (other than some inspectors/monitors) to be allocated
> > elsewhere. Local naval elements could assist SG-SR, be an parallel
> structure
> > in terms of this mandate, or direct SG-SR depending on agencies and their
> > heirarchies. In some particularly peaceful regions, some planets may not
> > even retain a system navy but instead have an SG-SR. There would be
> > integration/cooperation generally with local and Imperial law enforcement
> > around ports-of-entry, stations, and such like.
> >
> > * Providing security within the system - investigating crimes beyond the
> > mainworlds, pursuing and/or deterring piracy or barratry, securing
> stations,
> > high ports, and other sensitive system or Imperial assets (details would
> > vary depending on relationship of planet and Imperial government
> likely via
> > the charter that brought the planet into the Imperium). This also would
> > include security inspections of vessels, checks on the bona fides and
> > qualifications of ships and their crews, enforcement of safety and
> traffic
> > laws at times, and setting up temporary or permanent exclusion zones (to
> > avoid a danger for one reason, others exist) and for deploying aides to
> > navigation as necessary and maintaining them.
> >
> > * Conducting Intelligence work that falls within the mandate of protecting
> > ports, shipping, and so on related to system travel and commerce.
> >
> > * Search and rescue everywhere but on mainworlds - space search and rescue,
> > search and rescue on moons, small colonies, space habitats/stations, etc.
> > throughout the system.
> >
> > * In times of conflict, SG-SR vessels and personnel could be seconded to
> > either the system navy or the Imperial Navy.
> >
> > * May be seconded to assist in system-related science (schlepping
> boffins and
> > gear around, helping get the boffins near stellar or planetary
> environments
> > without losing them, etc). This could include some periodic system
> surveys
> > for any changes in the worlds/objects in the system and/or concerns
> that may
> > require warnings to be posted.
> >
> > What sorts of space-going assets would be involved:
> >
> > * Small fast response vessels - 500 tons or less - with a J-2 capacity
> > primarily used for fast in-system deployment and evacuation of injured to
> > stations/worlds/etc. that have better and more advanced medical
> options, and
> > with a thrust of 3gs or more (once wounded are embarked, no more than
> 0.75
> > or so perceivable gravities would be applied). Likely bearing a turret or
> > two to deter some threats, but mostly focused on medical response. High
> > quality sensors and computers would be used to do fast, accurate
> searches.
> > There would be one or more modular cutters with casualty evacuation
> > configurations available. Would have a loaded rack of dropable traffic
> > beacons and/or sensor platforms to increase search capacity.
> >
> > * Medium sized response vessels - Small hospital ship - a J-2 capacity
> vessel
> > with thrust of at J-3 (again limited with wounded embarked) and that
> would
> > include one or more surgical blocks (ORs, decontam, isolation, ICU and
> > standard beds, autodocs, nurses, parameds, doctors). A few turrets
> just for
> > basic deterrence, a situation room/fleet command capacity so good comms,
> > decent to high end sensors to help in searches and coordination of larger
> > responses. Also would have the ability to drop traffic beacons and sensor
> > platforms. Includes multiple offloading mechanisms (cutters, straight
> > docking, close-in assisted line crossings, etc). Would respond to
> more major
> > incidents or help to coordinate many smaller vessels for a search of
> a lot
> > of space/ground.
> >
> > * Fast Pursuit Vessels - 500 tons or less. Thrust 6 Gees, Jump 2 for
> similar
> > reasons as above, full complement of weapons, high end sensors for
> pursuing
> > and tracking vessels and other spacial objects that are of concern
> related
> > to security or law enforcement concerns. Includes SG boarding parties who
> > are specialists in ship boarding and inspection for security reasons.
> > Includes at least one armed auxilliary able to deploy up to 16
> boarders (two
> > teams). These vessels would be able to help in a search with their
> sensors
> > and could help with the security / traffic management during a large
> > disaster, but would have a primary role in going after fugitives and
> > inspecting vessels flagged as a potential threat to security.
> >
> > * System Tugs - J-2 wth capacity to bring back other ships on the
> return leg.
> > May be over 1000 tons. May be smaller ones that can provide a real-space
> > tow. Their job is to help get damaged or hazardous vessels or objects
> moved
> > to safer places for rescue/repair/disposal.
> >
> > * Tender - 400 to 600 tons - for deploying and maintaining (including
> annual
> > PMs) navigation aides, system sensor buoys, search platforms, science
> > platforms, and sometimes recovering or fixing in situ smaller SG-SR
> vessels
> > that have experienced serious problems that preclude them jumping of
> > thrusting to a repair destination.
> >
> > Funding would have a component derived from all corporations operating in or
> > passing through the system (a fee charged to ships or enterprises in the
> system
> > or passing through), some portion of mainworld and corporate businesses
> in the
> > system (because it is a public service), and perhaps in some places, they
> may
> > require payments after the fact for their services to help sustain
> operations.
> >
> > THoughts?
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > “The only stable state is the one in which all men are equal before the
> law.” ―
> > Aristotle
> >
> > -----
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>
> --
> Thomas Jones-Low
> Work: xxxxxx@softstart.com <mailto:xxxxxx@softstart.com>
> Home: xxxxxx@gmail.com <mailto:xxxxxx@gmail.com>
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Home: xxxxxx@gmail.com
