On 2 Aug 2016 12:07 pm, "Kelly St. Clair" <xxxxxx@efn.org> wrote:
>
> On 8/1/2016 4:46 PM, Richard Aiken wrote:
>>
>> No startown bars? No startown whores? Not even any meals off-ship? What
>> are these guys? Warrior monks?
>>
>> If they really do behave like that, then you are missing out on TONS of
>> Referee Evilness.
>
>
> In fairness, I submit that one possibility >is that this a learned response - >eliberate or not - *to* past experiences >with "Referee Evilness". That is, they >are staying buttoned up so that the GM >can't **** with them. I've seen this >happen, in games/groups where any >vulnerability, any lapse, any "human" >action is exploited.

I've not seen it live, but can well imagine.

> I further note that the immediate >response of several people on this list, >upon hearing of this group's behavior, >was to start coming up with ways *that* >could be used against them. There's >really no way for the players to win, is >there? (In the sense that "winning" is >defined, in this context, as not having >the GM throw additional complications >and/or obstacles at them while they're >simply trying to complete their >narrowly-focused objectives.)
>
> Players have their PCs do ridiculous >stuff like sleep in their armor because >they've been in games where if they >didn't, the GM would murder them in >their sleep. In worlds like that - where "God" hates you and wants to make your >ife a Job-like string of misery - paranoia >is *sane*, *justified* and/or a *survival >skill*.

LOL!

I quite agree and I hope you didn't take my reply as suggesting I thought that's what should happen. But I do think the referee is responsible for making *interesting* things happen - with fair rewards as well as the occasional bad things. (I've felt very guilty over having a character kidnapped at a funfair in one adventure).

And interesting things are unlikely to happen on board.

One of the reasons I wrote A Helping Hand (in the second Mongoose compendium IIRC) was to counter the 'nasty things happen if we go out' syndrome.

>
> You cannot *force* players to loosen >up; that requires trust, not the >application of further pressure, which >has the opposite effect.

Just so.

Although good examples and encouragement do sound like they might be lacking for the folk in the example given.